Author Message

<  Suggestions and Features  ~  Navigation "pins"

Kingfisher 829
Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 10:20 am Reply with quote
Admiral II

Level 19

115172 / 175000
Superskipper
Joined: 15 Feb 2012 Posts: 2078 GB
Hi Team,

In another virtual sailing world you had the use of "pins", that you could place; to help chart possible courses.
I used them to compare courses before making a decision, and it also saved so much time, as you knew where to place your wp's back to.
With the current system you only have your wp's...so if you look at one option then another, which turns out not so good...you have to go back again to find out where you started from.
They didn't form part of the actual course you navigate using your WP's, merely an additional tool.
A great help and time saver.

regards

Glenn

_________________
** Non Effugient **

View user's profile Send private message
Sowslo
Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 11:15 am Reply with quote
Admiral
Level 17
Joined: 24 Aug 2010 Posts: 2069 GB
The same can be done using WPs in multiple windows for testing various courses.

As each course set is sent to the server you just need to check that once you have made your decision you close all the 'discarded' windows and go back to 're-set' the preferred course.

Ideally don't go over a 10 minute update while doing this. Cool

_________________
View user's profile Send private message
Kingfisher 829
Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 11:25 am Reply with quote
Admiral II

Level 19

115172 / 175000
Superskipper
Joined: 15 Feb 2012 Posts: 2078 GB
Sowslo wrote:
The same can be done using WPs in multiple windows for testing various courses.

As each course set is sent to the server you just need to check that once you have made your decision you close all the 'discarded' windows and go back to 're-set' the preferred course.

Ideally don't go over a 10 minute update while doing this. Cool


Thanks Barbara...more than one way to "skin a cat" Shocked

_________________
** Non Effugient **

View user's profile Send private message
Jimbeam
Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 1:55 pm Reply with quote
Admiral V
Level 22
Joined: 07 May 2011 Posts: 518 Location: Karlsruhe DE
Hi Glenn,

I also would appreciate such a feature very much.

And I have also some enhancements to this feature which could be worth thinking about.
- It would be nice to measure distances from that pin (as we can do from a waypoint)
- Assigning a time to that pin would allow developing a course from that position

Another idea (which could be worth a separate suggestion) is to draw circles of constant distance around a pin or waypoint or the boat. Especially near the poles this would be very helpful since these circles are rather distorted due to the projection.

Perhaps we get an 'official' feedback from the LS crew.

Fair winds,
Juergen

_________________
View user's profile Send private message
Hallberg
Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:13 pm Reply with quote
Admiral II
Level 19
Joined: 24 Jun 2009 Posts: 11051 Location: Tournieres, Basse Normandie. (and England) FR
Mmmmmmm Not too sure about any of this.....Sounds like it would make the game too easy, therefore devalueing success.....

_________________
[url=http://www.liveskipper.com/][/url Once a Legionaire, always a Legionare....
View user's profile Send private message
Suratna
Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 4:40 am Reply with quote
Admiral III
Level 20
Joined: 02 Jul 2009 Posts: 8803 Location: Thailand TH
I read your suggestions for pins and try to understand the purpose, as compared to the marks that LS is offering now; 4 that is and 10 marks for those that support LS with a membership.

WRX1 wrote:
In another virtual sailing world you had the use of "pins", that you could place; to help chart possible courses.
Glenn


-One suggestion is made by Sowslo already for an alternative usage of the marks in LS.
The pins in the other virtual players, is also a compensation for not having the Marks functionality of LS. (none of the other virtual sailing players offers a polar projection, and ruler that reflect the wind conditions so accurate)

I use the marks to set one course and use the rest of the marks for an alternative course (easier with 10 marks of course; else I use the last marks of the first option course)
If the new alternative is better, keep its marks but
if the new alternative course is not better, you can remove the new marks and are left with the previous marks, except that the 1e mark may have changed from auto-heading to straight Rolling Eyes
also be aware that a mark at the end of a straight run is not moving, while a mark at the end of an auto-heading is moving along with other changes. So for searching alternative courses end the coures without the auto-helm and the mark will stay at its location be it that the time stamp will change.

- I wonder, whether the usage of marks and pins together would not start to complicate matters. Question


Jimbeam wrote:

I also would appreciate such a feature very much.
And I have also some enhancements to this feature which could be worth thinking about.
1)- It would be nice to measure distances from that pin (as we can do from a waypoint)
2)- Assigning a time to that pin would allow developing a course from that position
3)Another idea (which could be worth a separate suggestion) is to draw circles of constant distance around a pin or waypoint or the boat. Especially near the poles this would be very helpful since these circles are rather distorted due to the projection...
Juergen


Juergen for your 1) in LS now you can measure the distance from each of the marks, just activate the mark. so what difference would a pin make Question When measuring in auto-heading mode the "thick" curve give the distance in sailing that route, but the "thin" straight line is giving the straight distance on that heading.
2) this is exactly the capabilities of the marks in LS, (so why need another different "pin" Question )that has a time-stamp and with the polar projections , with the wind conditions at the time of the mark, you can see where to sail to in the next 3- 24 hrs; for me a Fantastic tool already.
3) I think that a "circle" near the polar circle already will most likely be a "ellips" rather than a "circle". though it will give some feeling of distance from a point. The marks in LS, however, give extra information in that the polar projection is using the wind-conditions around the mark for a period upto 24 hrs to show how far you can sail in any direction, using the different sials. That polar for me is far more powerful.

just my thoughts for what it is worth.

just now listening to the TOP2000 songs in Holland http://top2012.radio2.nl/lijst-standaard/#506 Kate Bush singing "Cloudbusting"

_________________
Ard-- http://vor201718.blogspot.com/ ; http://paper.li/ardsur/1345867159#
View user's profile Send private message
Jimbeam
Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:39 am Reply with quote
Admiral V
Level 22
Joined: 07 May 2011 Posts: 518 Location: Karlsruhe DE
Hi Ard,

the basic idea of the pin is just to indicate a position.

In contrast to a position the mark is in any case a position plus a time to get there. This means that you cannot develop two courses in parallel to decide which is better. So you have to develop them one after another. But after developing the second course you don't know the first course any more (at least not exactly).

Here the pins come into play. You can remember the first course by pins, clear all marks and develop the second course with marks. And if the first was better you have the pins to re-develop the first course.

Juergen

_________________
View user's profile Send private message
Kingfisher 829
Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 1:33 pm Reply with quote
Admiral II

Level 19

115172 / 175000
Superskipper
Joined: 15 Feb 2012 Posts: 2078 GB
Jimbeam wrote:
Hi Ard,

the basic idea of the pin is just to indicate a position.

In contrast to a position the mark is in any case a position plus a time to get there. This means that you cannot develop two courses in parallel to decide which is better. So you have to develop them one after another. But after developing the second course you don't know the first course any more (at least not exactly).

Here the pins come into play. You can remember the first course by pins, clear all marks and develop the second course with marks. And if the first was better you have the pins to re-develop the first course.

Juergen


Thanks Juergen..
This is what i meant.. the "pins" themselves have no features, other than being stuck on a chart.

_________________
** Non Effugient **

View user's profile Send private message
Hallberg
Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 5:40 pm Reply with quote
Admiral II
Level 19
Joined: 24 Jun 2009 Posts: 11051 Location: Tournieres, Basse Normandie. (and England) FR
Whatever happened to using real experience, Real boats, real charts, no 'pins' Sailing by the seat of yer arse....... Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

_________________
[url=http://www.liveskipper.com/][/url Once a Legionaire, always a Legionare....
View user's profile Send private message
Kingfisher 829
Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 5:52 pm Reply with quote
Admiral II

Level 19

115172 / 175000
Superskipper
Joined: 15 Feb 2012 Posts: 2078 GB
Hallberg wrote:
Whatever happened to using real experience, Real boats, real charts, no 'pins' Sailing by the seat of yer arse....... Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes


Haha the type of sailing i did, i could see all the marks, and make snap decisions on a wind shift...with the whole plan in my bonce

Here to be just a little competitive if you cant either be at the keyboard all day long, or use routing software... you have to try something to either keep up with those that do, or see something no one else might.

I think Barb's option is one to think on, for the "fridays" etc..
The longer races - lap of the gods.

_________________
** Non Effugient **

View user's profile Send private message
ANDRZEY
Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 10:58 am Reply with quote
Admiral I
Level 18
Joined: 09 Oct 2009 Posts: 677 Location: POLAND PL
Dear Skippers,

As I understand Glenn wants to have "pins" like "Marks" in "VRTool".
You can place a Mark on map manually or using coordinates.
In my opinion this is a very good idea Exclamation
It is very useful to mark some important places on the map in real and virtual racing Laughing

Best regards
Andrzej

_________________
View user's profile Send private message
Jimbeam
Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 1:25 pm Reply with quote
Admiral V
Level 22
Joined: 07 May 2011 Posts: 518 Location: Karlsruhe DE
ANDRZEY wrote:
Dear Skippers,

As I understand Glenn wants to have "pins" like "Marks" in "VRTool".
You can place a Mark on map manually or using coordinates.
In my opinion this is a very good idea Exclamation
It is very useful to mark some important places on the map in real and virtual racing Laughing

Best regards
Andrzej


Hi Andrzej,

this is exactly what I also meant.
I surely don't use external tools, not even an external grib viewer. So these pins are a good enhancement to LS planning capabilities.

Juergen

_________________
View user's profile Send private message
ANDRZEY
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 9:42 am Reply with quote
Admiral I
Level 18
Joined: 09 Oct 2009 Posts: 677 Location: POLAND PL
Hello LS TEAM Laughing ,
May I ask you about your opinion regarding "pins"?
Best regards
Andrzej

_________________
View user's profile Send private message
Sowslo
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 11:22 am Reply with quote
Admiral
Level 17
Joined: 24 Aug 2010 Posts: 2069 GB
As I have never used a 'pins' concept and find 10 marks more than meet my needs I think it best to stay out of the debate.

_________________
View user's profile Send private message
ANDRZEY
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:22 pm Reply with quote
Admiral I
Level 18
Joined: 09 Oct 2009 Posts: 677 Location: POLAND PL
Sowslo wrote:
As I have never used a 'pins' concept and find 10 marks more than meet my needs I think it best to stay out of the debate.

My opinion is completely different.
I've never used 10 marks to plan the route. Every 6 hours my plan should be modified. I have not so much time for such time-consuming work.

I used to use Marks in VRTool very often Laughing .
Marks help me to find the best route. Marks not depends on winds or my current heading etc. Marks are always visible on my map in the same place everyday.
I could mark not well visible islands on the big areas, or place a turning point as the beginning of proper way into the complicated archipelago or narrow strait etc.

May be it is not the end of this idea?
I don't mind that this is too difficult to make in LS software Laughing

Best regards
Andrzej

_________________
View user's profile Send private message

Display posts from previous:  

All times are GMT
Page 1 of 2
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Post new topic

Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum