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<  Clubs  ~  Club Trophy - beta version

Veloce Origine CM
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:55 pm Reply with quote
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Level 15
Joined: 04 Oct 2012 Posts: 2209 Location: Messimy (69) de Auray (56) FR
Beta Version

I would like to propose you a permanent club Trophy with no need to register. This Trophy would allow club rankings for each race, the current FR season as well as the current Overall.

It seems to me that clubs are not enough put forward, meanwhile they are an essencial way to bring more life to the site. I personally appreciate the two levels of the race : both individual performance and teammates support during the race.

Permanent inter-club contest could bring club development. What do you think of this ?

I read the forum and got inspired by Suratna's follow-up as well as inter-clubs challenge from marcopolyo_FMV. This week proposal from Deyanira NTN for an inter-team contest for the end of FR season goes the same way. (I do not mean to compete with these former initiatives but to try and perpetuate them).

To avoid a tedious follow-up as well as the problem of registrations, I took inspiration from Suratna's follow up to develop a semi-atomated calculation system.



I suggest to post :
  1. the current Overall ranking at th eend of each big race :



  2. the current FR season at the end of each Friday :



  3. a ranking at the end of each big race :



  4. a final ranking of each Friday :



  5. a temporary ranking of each big race, along the way, to follow the evolution of club rankings :








Ranking method :
  1. Live Skipper calculus formula : Score = 0,86^(sqrt(ranking)-1) x 1000
  2. Will be ranked the clubs with a minimum of 4 members, 32 clubs as of today.
  3. The club is the sum of its 7 best boats.
  4. The final ranking of a race is established when at least 330 skippers have crossed the finish line (80% of the points appointed to the top 1 000 skippers), in order to avoid to wait for several days or even weeks.
What do you think of these 4 parameters ? Do they need do be adjusted ?



Le même débat en français ici.
El mismo debate en español aqui.


Last edited by Veloce Origine CM on Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:06 pm; edited 4 times in total

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Manu CybMar (CM)
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Suratna
Posted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 1:46 pm Reply with quote
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Joined: 02 Jul 2009 Posts: 8806 Location: Thailand TH
Hallo Manu o/b Veloce Origine CM

thanks for the effort you put in a kind of Club rankings.
It looks good

I did never realise that LS has already so many active Clubs, so indeed it is good to show the strength and capabilities of the different Clubs.

The good thing of your Club ranking is that it is very easy to understand: The Club with the highest score has 7 good sailors Laughing
The other good thing is that the skippers do not have to do anything more, no registration, no nothing other than sailing to their level best.

I like it. Thanks and go on Laughing


Your 4 elements for the ranking, I do agree with them be it that with the number of skippers per Club increased from 20 to 30, the number of participating Boats per Club maybe needs a review in a years time and we have to keep an eye on the growing number of clubs to decide on the number of skippers for the final ranking. The good thing is that you keep the LS scoring-system for individual boats; such using familiar ranking numbers.

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Veloce Origine CM
Posted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:08 pm Reply with quote
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Joined: 04 Oct 2012 Posts: 2209 Location: Messimy (69) de Auray (56) FR
Suratna wrote:
The Club with the highest score has 7 good sailors [...] the number of participating Boats per Club maybe needs a review in a years time and we have to keep an eye on the growing number of clubs to decide on the number of skippers for the final ranking.
I took this number of 7 skippers from Marcopolyo's inter-club Challenge. It seems to be a fair balance when you consider the following :
  1. if this number si too high, small clubs don't have a chance
  2. if this number is too low, most skippers from large clubs will feel useless.
  3. you don't heve 100% of skippers from a club on water
  4. some boats from a club don't run each race when the club includes the team boat or boat #2 or #3 from some skipppers
  5. if this number is low, it will not motivate club manager to develop their club
If I realize that the average of participating skippers per club is too much below, then I will lower it to 6. If after some time the clubs start to fill up, then I will increase it to 8 (maybe up to 10 but I doubt it).

As for the minimum number of members for a club to enter the Trophy, I first thought of putting it to 5 as 5 good skippers would bring a much better result than 7 out of 15 average skippers. However I gave it a second thought since allowing the clubs with 4 members could be a good incentive for them to grow. 3 was definitely too little since it can bearly be called a club.

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Manu CybMar (CM)
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Hallberg
Posted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:41 pm Reply with quote
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Joined: 24 Jun 2009 Posts: 11052 Location: Tournieres, Basse Normandie. (and England) FR
My problem with all of this is that there are Clubs that practice 'Boat sharing' and Routers....LSYC does not. It is the Rule. So it cannot be fair........

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Veloce Origine CM
Posted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:03 pm Reply with quote
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Hallberg wrote:
My problem with all of this is that there are Clubs that practice 'Boat sharing' and Routers....LSYC does not. It is the Rule. So it cannot be fair........
These are problems that cannot be solved. Boat sharing I don't know off (not for the CybMar), and Open vs Passion is already the same for individual boats (the rule #1 from CybMar is : No Router). It has been discussed over and over on LS and there is no solution.

I may, later on, create a separate Club Trophy for 100% dedicated 100% Passion clubs. I will see.

Anyway, skippers with no router may win as proved ConstantShadow, With Integrity and gauloix who were on the Sail the Globe's podium without ny router. Clubs with no router may also lead the Trophy, since the CybMar are currently ranked 1st without using any router.


Victory tatses even better when wits beat the machines !

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Manu CybMar (CM)
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Veloce Origine CM
Posted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:42 pm Reply with quote
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Suratna wrote:
The good thing of your Club ranking is that it is very easy to understand: The Club with the highest score has 7 good sailors Laughing
Not true : the Neptuno NTN would still easily lead the FR Season 7 even if they only summed up their 4 top players ! (this proves by the way that clubs with 4 members may get a decent club ranking on some races)

This means that you may either have a few excellent players or a solid group of regular skippers. Nevertheless, the more skippers and the better skippers will help you build a high score.

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Manu CybMar (CM)
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Veloce Origine CM
Posted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 9:44 pm Reply with quote
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More Trophies : all the races which ended in 2013 (based on the members on March 1st) :
















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Veloce Origine CM
Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 11:15 pm Reply with quote
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The Trophy gave a kick to the clubs : clubs with 4 or more members went from 32 to 35 within a week !
  • The LYSC are now the more numerous with 21 members (*)
  • The Yacht Club Lampaulais (YCL) grew to 10 members.
  • The Cyber Marins split with a second club Cyber Marins Plaisance
  • The CRO club was launched
  • more clubs recruited ...
(*) The Wiki says that the maximum members per club is 20. Why did it change this week ? There has to be a fixed limit.

I now have to fix my Trophy computation ...


Last edited by Veloce Origine CM on Sat Mar 09, 2013 2:42 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Manu CybMar (CM)
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Hallberg
Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 11:35 pm Reply with quote
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The limit is now 30...............

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Veloce Origine CM
Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 11:43 pm Reply with quote
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Was there any reason for that ? Any request for that ? When did this occur ?

Too bad : we just split our CybMar club this week ...

It will also change the balance for the parameters of the Trophy, I'll think of it.

I will increase the difference between small and large clubs. May be not so good to motivate new clubs.

We thought it was better to increase the number of clubs rather than the number of members. This is why the CybMar created a 2nd club as the FMV who launched 3 clubs : FMV team, FMV II, FMV Diablotins.

Maybe this update is not definite ?

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Manu CybMar (CM)
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Hallberg
Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2013 12:22 am Reply with quote
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It's definite..... More Tomorrow........... Now is time to sleep........ Wink

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Veloce Origine CM
Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2013 2:41 pm Reply with quote
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Here is an update for the Overall Global and the Overall Passion. Quite some changes after the raise of the YCL and the start of the Lost race !




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vanna
Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2013 8:37 pm Reply with quote
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V.O CM, maybe from time to time to have the possibility to enter the club and see how some members are doing.
That probably will not be possible as it would be much of additional work for you.

However I must say that I like this your idea of additional competition.

I see that our team CRO CLUB is moving up towards the middle of ranking which is not bad for only 5 boats racing at present.

Damir

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Veloce Origine CM
Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2013 11:28 pm Reply with quote
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vanna wrote:
from time to time to have the possibility to enter the club and see how some members are doing.
Sorry but I did not get what you want to do. Can you tell me again ?

During each long race, I will post intermediate results for the Club Trophy (as I did today under the Lost race topic).

At the end of each Friday or long race, I will also post the current Overall Trophy.

This will already be difficult to keep up with since I post under the 3 languages ...
vanna wrote:
I see that our team CRO CLUB is moving up towards the middle of ranking which is not bad for only 5 boats racing at present.
You guys made a nice entry in the Trophy ! Get to 10 boats so that your 7 best can be added.

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Manu CybMar (CM)
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Suratna
Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 2:23 am Reply with quote
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vanna wrote:
V.O CM, maybe from time to time to have the possibility to enter the club and see how some members are doing.
....
Damir


Hi Damir
LS is giving already a ranking for individual Clubs and all its members.
In the GAME Menu, there is the RANKING sub-menu. Select the race you want and all club-members that have or are participating in that race are listed.

I now see that this list of Races does not include the Overall nor the FR overall. Question I wonder why and will try to find out.

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